Talk:Lumescant
Conversation, Facebook, Nov 9, 2013: Regarding the 'Laws' and Lumescant H: ...Lumescant, for example has the law of knowledge, which is simply that knowledge is power. So there, those with the most knowledge of any given subject have the most power there D: Lumescant should offer some explanation of the rules, any knowledgeable group would have a meta awareness and description of things. D: Although you have the opportunity to change how knowledge is defined. well, how it's catalogued, or stored. H: Good point, I didn't think of that, but yeah, Lumescant would likely have a better perception of the patterns and therefore would be able to define the laws. As for the definition of knowledge, I'm debating on making it partly what we know as knowledge and partly instinct, like the more knowledge you have, however minute, it.. Adapts people, in a way, to be more self-learning towards that subject if that makes sense. Which is how the one man made the first Gates H: And oh, catalogue makes more sense H: I've been mentally building a library, but not of books D: consider a web vs. a tree. in terms of structure, for example. H: That ill actually probably need help with, its something like knowledge is accessible based on qualifications and requirements, so there is control on what people can learn, or at least what knowledge can be "taken out of the library" literally H: But I don't know how I'll do that yet H: Maybe a Ghost in the Shell type thing where people can go into the Internet and aren't fully human?? D: I have some ideas, wait, the tech is that advanced? because in that case genetic encoding is an option. H: Yeah Lumescant is by FAR the most advanced. You'll notice in chapter three, Anubis will keep referring to technology as "Lumescant stuff" Dave.lenton (talk) 04:12, December 30, 2013 (UTC) Conversation, Facebook, Nov 30, 2013: Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:47 UTC-04 Even the public knowledge in Lumescent could be restricted. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:49 UTC-04 Hehehe you're connecting the same wires I am. Someone in Lumescant is going to be the first person to stumble upon the knowledge and every time he leaves the "library" (I'm not sure what to call it, archives is over used) he knows he learned something important but can't remember what because he shouldn't even have access to it Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:49 UTC-04 Oh yeah, I should mention what a retrovirus is. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:49 UTC-04 Please do :D Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:50 UTC-04 It's a virus that injects it's own genome into a host cell to encourage replication of itself. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:51 UTC-04 In theory, they could be tuned to genetically modify people Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:51 UTC-04 without killing them through infection (HIV is a retrovirus) Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:53 UTC-04 Interesting. And in a place like Lumescant the technology would definitely be available to do such a thing (minus the killing.. Bad HIV) since we discussed before that in Lumescant, knowledge is power, a retrovirus could be the reason certain knowledge is allowed or restricted. Like it did something to alter the brain?? Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:53 UTC-04 I always think of ghost in the shell Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:55 UTC-04 Well Lumescant is an interesting place. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:56 UTC-04 Is all information free? Is none of it? Is it free under a genetically manipulated illusion? Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:56 UTC-04 Are there hierarchies? Who/how are they governed? Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 03:59 UTC-04 Gene therapies could actually make everyone smart, so that's a real option. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:00 UTC-04 Or early on they had a messed up reproduction system Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:04 UTC-04 Information is.. Given. Some verbally (language and manners, taught to children by parents) whereas anything beyond that requires access. For example, you don't attend a school lecture to learn math, you go to a learning facility and download the day's lesson. Fool proof system, you do not get distracted or forget nothing once it's there (unless it is revoked by I'll get to that later) there are definitely hierarchies. I'm having a hard time explaining it fluidly but it's determined by knowledge and the more knowledge you have the more access to knowledge you have. Which makes the system unfair. Those wealthier in knowledge do not want to share their power therefore they control knowledge yet give off the impression that there is equality. The people are governed by voted officials but the system is obviously rigged assuming someone knows what to look for Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:05 UTC-04 Then to reply to another comment you made, no, not everyone is smart. Its a control thing Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:05 UTC-04 Explain the messed up reproduction system theory?? Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:05 UTC-04 Only smart people can have sex Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:05 UTC-04 and they have a lot of it. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:06 UTC-04 It's the fastest way to make the world smarter (on a generational timescale) Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:06 UTC-04 Because I don't mean smart as in educated, I mean smart as in brilliant, or intelligent. The ability to comprehend, perceive meaning, and process information. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:07 UTC-04 In a way, you could make a point about how in Lumescant true power is not in knowledge, but in intelligence; or the ability to wield knowledge. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:08 UTC-04 Oh!! Ohoho I rather like that idea. Not as a starter but as something the intelligent are trying to make happen. And yeah noted. Education vs intelligence will definitely play a role, I just haven't decided where yet.. And you just answered my question Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:08 UTC-04 which question? Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:09 UTC-04 The leaders would mostly be corrupt, but a few very devious ones could use partial knowledge to imply/infer greater things (to deduce like Holmes) and gain more knowledge than they're entitled to have. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:12 UTC-04 How to incorporate education vs intelligence. If lower class people are made to believe education is knowledge they would never have a reason to improve their intelligence. They would believe their knowledge is equal to the higher class when in reality it is not because the upper class teaches their young to improve intelligence (it could be a selective system, like rich children are tested for intelligence and those that "pass" are trained for certain roles) and I like the deduction idea too Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:14 UTC-04 tutors and teachers would be highly respected positions. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:15 UTC-04 because the libraries cannot confer intelligence, it must be learned. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:17 UTC-04 I really should be writing this stuff down as we discuss it haha. And yeah that makes sense. The library is more for "extra learning" but because knowledge is so sacred it is still controlled. But yeah the library does not give knowledge so much as hold it, gaining knowledge from the library requires hacking systems Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:19 UTC-04 hacking, that's a dangerous game to play. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:19 UTC-04 Like on my part or the character's?? Haha Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:20 UTC-04 Both. Hacking today is such a fantastically complicated process that I couldn't begin to understand it. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:20 UTC-04 and as a software programmer I like to think I know a tad about computers. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:21 UTC-04 and in Lumescant, where you actually have machines mapping neural networks in the brain, makes what we do look like child's play. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:21 UTC-04 Especially considering that the smartest people in the world wrote the access systems. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:22 UTC-04 or had the brains to re-write them. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:23 UTC-04 the only conceivable way a hacker could even gain the knowledge to accomplish this feat is if: 1) they are already so smart they'd have access 2) they're not from Lumescant 3) someone is siphoning off restricted information and teaching it to the less informed. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:27 UTC-04 my recommendation when discussing hacking is to stay very high-level. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:27 UTC-04 touch nothing concrete, because it could latched on to. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:28 UTC-04 Noted. Now to be fair the people hacking aren't just random people, it's an entire network that also has some of Lumescant's smartest people on their side. Hmmm you know now that I think about it this I remember I wanted your help. Because when in Lumescant I focus on two spies. Both planted as upper class citizens (one a beginning politician the other a socialite) but both getting information. The idea was something along the lines of the socialite extracts information, pass codes or whatever from the minds of the wealthy then gives it to the other spy who uses his access to the library and the passcodes she gives him to gain information that is supposed to be above their access Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:28 UTC-04 High level how?? And yeah I never wanted to be too concrete haha Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:28 UTC-04 I'm aware that I lack the intelligence for that Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:28 UTC-04 Because no one is supposed to have that kind of intelligence Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:29 UTC-04 High level like no code (Michael Crichton does it, looks dumb) Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:30 UTC-04 when explaining how something works, basic analogy only, lots of hand waving. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:31 UTC-04 dumb it down below your own understanding, otherwise you'll look like you're reaching when you really are out of your depth (that's general advice, George Orwell and Isaac Asimov both did it and I was very disappointed) Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:32 UTC-04 Noted. The code thing won't be hard, that didn't seem right in this world. And yeah, hand waving I can do. Your advice is noted(: Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:33 UTC-04 Cool. now remind me how levelling up works (promoting to the higher tier of access) Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:34 UTC-04 Hmmmm okay did you ever read 1984?? Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:35 UTC-04 yeah that's the Orwell I was referencing. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:36 UTC-04 Oh duh. Totally spaced on that. Well If I remember correctly there, social standing was part birth, part testing. You could be in the middle class, then once tested either become upper class, remain middle class, or be demoted to lower class. Am I right?? Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:36 UTC-04 Anyway.. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:37 UTC-04 Pretty much yeah, based on aptitude testing. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:37 UTC-04 It's a similar system in Lumescant, only less decided by a general test and more a selection from the people who already have the highest standing (government leaders) Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:39 UTC-04 Ok, so the most knowledgeable select their successors. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:40 UTC-04 That's confusing knowledge with wisdom, another intentional? Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:42 UTC-04 So you could be a farmer's kid, but test as intelligent. Some government official could find use of you and take you in, give you more knowledge and teach you how to expand your intelligence then land you a more middle class job. But say your intelligence continues being developed and exercised (I'm not sure that's accurate but whatever it's fiction) and you're obviously better than everyone else. You keep getting promoted. Someone else higher up takes notice of you, develops your knowledge even further. And as long as you have natural intelligence and the desire to keep "learning" chances are someone will eventually notice. Because the higher up people look for lower class people like that. Partly as successors yes, but sometimes just to use them. I'm not sure if blurring that with wisdom was intentional or not, actually. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:43 UTC-04 well, wisdom is knowing the right thing to do, not knowing everything. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:44 UTC-04 I'm suggesting that the masses believe the leaders promote out of their 'wisdom', when it's actually out of self-interest, and they hide their cunning behind displays of knowledge. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:46 UTC-04 Oh yeah duh. No in that case wisdom and knowledge are completely separate. But yeah what you said is basically how the system works. People believe the leaders act on wisdom when they actually act based on their own schemes Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:47 UTC-04 ok Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:47 UTC-04 You could, and I'm just saying it because so many do, weave religion into that kind of power. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:49 UTC-04 I could. Hmmm but with Lumescant knowledge kind of is their religion. It's what the people strive for, what they worship. I don't feel like (most of them) are the kind of people to worship a specific being Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:50 UTC-04 If you worship it, it's a religion. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:51 UTC-04 The acquisition of new knowledge is a very mystical event. Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:52 UTC-04 especially if it is of importance to the Cartulary, which is what I'm calling it until a better name is found. Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:53 UTC-04 Mmmmhmmmmm I like that. And the name too what does that mean?! In case you haven't noticed I have an obsession with the meaning of words Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:54 UTC-04 Also gaining of knowledge would explain why teachers would be so important because they're part of something sacred Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:54 UTC-04 They're basically the priests of their world Dave LentonSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:56 UTC-04 http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/cartulary Hannah BillsSaturday, 30 November 2013 at 04:59 UTC-04 Noted. Not quite right but pretty close so useable for now(: